PVP Tuesdays Evening - very hush hush

[Neodragus]

One thing you've got wrong there Ben, Fury warriors are not PvP warriors, in the slightest, sure, they can do some damage, but they are no where near as good as an arms warriors, unless the fury warrior is geared to the eyeballs, although a geared MS warrior is better PvP wise (trust me here, they're pretty much my specialty here).
Feral combat druids are pretty awesome in PvP, i'm hearing so many complaints about them in PvP and druids and theres a small thing to increase the PvE damage for Arms warriors in the fury tree, but anyway, this isn't a warrior discussion! Classes I feel are good for Arena as we're looking at this as a small party / PvP thing, an Arms warrior seems as a must as they are amazing burst damage and usually scare the crap out of most groups... a Rogue (one class that I will gladly play) for that oh so sweet shadow step, Druids (Another I can be signed up for if u wish ^^) have the ability to heal, ranged dps, two different CC's (if i'm right they can't both be used at the same time but have different CD timers) Paladins are probably the best choice of a healer for arena, closely followed by shaman, (thats a third i'd be willing to take the opportunity to play) however shaman are a good choice for a dps aswell, (elemental spec, NOT ENHANCEMENT) Ice Mages are another nasty choice, Fire mages and PoM Pyro aren't really a great choice as the frost spells hack off most people and ... bahh! raid time!! *runs away* i'll post more later!

[Twylyte]

Here's a question..

Lets say one of our players is a maniac called Neodragus who always charges in and batters the hell out of someone.

We  have a shammy, a druid and a pally. We all have the macro /target Neodragus /cast heal (or whatever the appropriate spell is called)
Instantly Neodragus gets 2 instant heals and a heal over time  (that's the druid) from 3 players

That's one click from 3 players and Neo can go mental all over again.

My question is ... do we need a dedicated healer?
Or can we rotate characters to heal; none of whome is a dedicated healer

Let's say we don't have a Shadow Preist

We have a Lock, Shammy, Pally, Druid and a Rogue

What's the kill order against that group AND would it work or does the Pally still need to heal?

Would we wouldn't need a Warrior if the Pally was a Retribution Pally and played by a Pally expert in PaladinFTW??

what do you think?

[Magorian]

I'll deal with what Adz said first,
 
First things first, fury/arms warriors regardless of what I call them I mean the big nasty one with MS/WW with a big bastard hard double handed weapon, so's not to confuse everyone

  There is no point [and I really mean this] in having a druid there if your going to go feral spec with him when you already have a warrior and a rogue. That group is not blanced because there is an overreliance on mellee DPS and if one had to go, it should be the druid. As with all classes with an excellent player it doesn't matter but I wouldn't sacrifice MS/WW or Shadow step for a feral druid [choose an ability it's not really important since although the abilities have better spread, it's situational and you have to be able to morph out and pull it off without being mauled]

  If the idea is to keep things simple which lets be honest, if your working as a team you want a clearly defined role
for everyone in the team so you can get a good strategy going, remember this is 5v5 and it requires a little pre planning and getting used to others play styles so the easier you can define roles the better.

 
Right on to what Mark says,
   It's a nice idea matey but what you've gotta consider is there are 5 people in the group and it would be stupid of them to attack the warrior, they'd go straight for the healers, in PVE it would work wonders but remember your playing against real players who will just take out the valuable members first.

  I'd say best bet is this team with a few changes

Lock: No brainer, you need a good player but it's an easy role fear, stun & DoT

Pally: No arguements here, bubble and plate armour make him the hardest healer by a mile

Shammy/Priest: Both will spec for damage but have the option of off healing if needed or if the main healer dies. Lots of damage thrown out and totems/PwF and fear ward make them very powerful choices.

Rogue/Druid: Your call here I guess, I say the rogue is harder but if you insist on taking a feral druid, then take him over the rogue since they essentially fill the same role  i.e. stealth and kill the healers/most dangerous and rogues have sap as another CC choice.

Choice 5: I stick with a MS warrior, silly damage and halving healing effects makes him ludicrously hard, not to mention a big fear for CC if needed. This is slot number 5 though so any archetype would do, frost mage is usefull for extra mana and a sheep [though that has been nurfed of late],

Your other advantage with lock pally shammy rogue warrior is that you got a nice 5 man group for instances whilst levelling too.

 

[Neodragus]

You mean Arms warriors Ben = D thats the nasty beggers ^_^
and looking at things now, after fighting lots of druids (I've spent most of today in arena) druids aren't that tough in a group, it's only solo they're arses... and an MS warrior is almost a must have, aswell as a rogue as they are pretty amazing, the blind on any target, and the saps and stuns... oh man! *dribbles slightly*
Now, The paladin is a must, and it'll have to be Holy with about 15 in prot (thats only roughly)
Now, surprisignly clothies are probably the best source to have in a 5vs5 team, theyre like the socialist dicks in wow like the americans are in real life... mages.... sheep to get rid of a healer or dps for a while, whilst the priest and warlock have the fear that screws everyone over unless your a warrior thats smart and hasn't blown your cooldowns as quickly as some people blow their load... (sorry for talking like this, i've been watching too many videos where games are talked about in such a way that it's funny when said quickly, just imagine i'm speaking really fast and without any punctuation at all...) now, We have three members decided upon Me James (Pala) and Mark now, thats three classes i was thinking here:
Me - Rogue
James - Paladin
Mark - Mage (or some other thing u wish that'd be good In Arena)
anyone want to volounteer for anything? if no one else, we could just do this as a 3v3 thing, that would mean we can start quicker and what not, now i'm pretty bored with playing wow and that after a day of bad arena with people who have the mental capacity of a walnut, so i'll bid u all farewell for now, i'll come back when i'm in a better mood...

[Twylyte]

Thanks for all this input though guys I'm learning a lot. I've never done Arena stuff so this is a really valuable conversation to me.

I think I'd like to play Mage or Lock and I think I'll go for Lock.

So, the concensus is

Lock = Me
Rogue = Neo
Pally = James
Warrior = Vacancy
Shaman = Vacancy

I think we can fill those vacancies you know. We can constantly instance run if we get 5 which also would be useful. I still think Ben would make a great Shammy though don't you think???

Mark

[Magorian]

I would love to give it a go guys but I really just don't have as much time as i'd like free these days. I'll see what I can do but what with my computer not being great and my internet being slow, i've not been playing at all. Well se how things pan out over the next few days since my ISP changes on the 12th I may be able to move things around if I get a stable connection

[Magorian]

On a related note, I just stayed up most  of the night watching a WoW 3v3 arena tournament, and the winners were a team called pandemic who were playing with a priest, rogue and mage team.
 As it turns out the majority of the healers were druids which makes sense considering I guess considering the multiple CC and having the advantage of arena gear so they can heal and take a beating and  they can run away. It's this new insta change ability given to druids so they can switch between forms instantly and it means you can hotkey moves whilst not in form and auto switch, very nasty. Strangely no pallies as healers but I guess in 3v3 it's more about doing a load of damage.
   Defo interesting, the 2v2 winners earlier in the day we're a 2v2 side warrior/druid combo so something to bear in mind

[Twylyte]

Mags
Don't commit if you can't make it of course. There would be little fun if you were 4 levels behind us all the time.  But of course it would be fantatsic to set something up so different for a few of us especially if the aim is to be as good as we can be as a team.

I've never played on a PVP realm so scrapping other players on the fly is going to be really big fun. Especially if it all kicks off as I saw once (on a non pvp server) in Astranaar. The idea of constantly facing the threat of ambush or aggro seems far more appealing if you are always in a well coordinated group of 5.  I'm not really into the notion of bullying smaller players but bullying bigger ones who start it - bring it on!!



I had a chat with John (Gurge) about 5v5. His advice (as well as expect, at first, to lose a lot) was pretty much that you can make any group of players work so long as you learn, in great detail,  how the others play. 

Go On Mags take the Shammy !! Or are you scared of my tiny little Lock.......


Neo
If you take the Rogue have a look at the Troll starting package (the race skills they get) - let me know what you think..


Mark

[Neodragus]

I was actually thinking blood elf Rogue, they have an AoE silence, admittedly it lasts two seconds, but, that silence will stop heals, not many things are adapted for being rogues, I think undead are one of the best choice for rogues, but i'd be so far away from everyone accept whatever blood elf we have...

[Twylyte]

Bloof elm hmm - we could have two AOE silence !!
I was thinking Blood elf for mage they have some lovely stuff for casters but if I play Lock probably Orc they have tougher pets and can do more damage (albeit at half healing). i might be tempted by undead though.

Strange though I'd have thought regeneration, extra dodge and extra damage might be tempting. Trolls seem to be built for Rogues I thought - but your call matey.
Re where we start I will happilly travel although i envisage we just meet up after an 45 min after our starting areas. But I'll hook up with whereever everyone else is.

When I am next on line I'll see if I can recruit to the last two places - Neo have you spoken to smisk about this??

Mark

[Paladinftw]

Bloof elm hmm - we could have two AOE silence !!

Don't be forgetting that I would be able to provide one. The only Horde race that you can have a pally on is BElf.

[Twylyte]

At level 70 the Orc class ability increases attack power by 282 for 15 seconds and increases  resistance to stun by 15% -  30 sec cooldown
The Troll one increases attack speed by 10% to 30% for 10 seconds. They also regenerate at 10% whilst in combat - 1 min cooldown
A blood elf rogue can silence for 2 seconds at a radius of 8 yards - cooldown 10 min. 

Mark

[Paladinftw]

Common guys, lets not let this crash and burn. Lets make this idea work! So we need 2 more people to fill gaps within the team, lets get sourcing those players! Anyone who hasn't already posted their interests in this team, POST NOW!

Common guys!

[Neodragus]

Spinebrekers Decided name, My characters Neodragus, Skarab is Mark (Jarlene) and James (Paladinftw) is gonna be called something like Eyecandi or eyecandy
come on and join us guys!

[Shotz]

If only this was coming 4-5 months later, I'd really be interested in joining.

I've just joined Shadowsong, and of course, my 2nd character was a Rogue for a bank...and with enchanting and engineering, a lvl 19 twink

But with Shotz, Nuka (the week-play character with Swifty) and Kali (Bank), I think I'm already starting to get back into my alt-whore ways. I *will* have one level 70 on any server before I make a single other alt!